The Catalyze podcast: Kickin’ It in the Kitchen, with Prince Rivers ’28 on Civic Collaboration with Milwaukee’s Alive Foundation

Welcome to Kickin’ It in the Kitchen, a miniseries by the Catalyze podcast that explores the transformative summers of the Morehead-Cain Program. In the Civic Collaboration summer, teams of scholars embed themselves in cities across North America to investigate community challenges, work alongside local partners, and propose solutions grounded in real needs.

In this episode, host Aadya Gattu ’28 of the Scholar Media Team sits down with Prince Rivers ’28 about his summer in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Working with MKE Fellows, Prince and his team tackled the challenge of expanding access to higher education for underserved communities.

Their conversation explores how the team navigated ambiguity in their project, learned to live and work together in a new city, and discovered Milwaukee’s culture along the way, including memorable moments at local music festivals. Prince reflects on the importance of human-centered design, the value of community partnership, and what it means to propose real solutions to complex problems.

Listen to the episode. Watch the episode on YouTube.

Music credits

The episode’s intro song is by scholar Scott Hallyburton ’22, guitarist of the band South of the Soul.

How to listen

On your mobile device, you can listen and subscribe to Catalyze on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. For any other podcast app, you can find the show using our RSS feed. You can let us know what you thought of the episode by finding us on social media @moreheadcain or you can email us at communications@moreheadcain.org.

Episode Transcription

(Aadya)

Welcome to Kickin’ It in the Kitchen, a series from the Catalyze podcast.  I’m your host, Aadya Gattu, from the class of 2028. This series explores the how, why, and what behind the Morehead-Cain Summer Enrichment Program. Over the course of four years, scholars progress through four summers: the Outdoor Leadership, Civic Collaboration, Global Perspective, and Professional Experience. These metamorphic summers are designed to help scholars develop their leadership, grow their self-awareness, and expand their understanding of the world. In this episode, we speak with Prince Rivers from the class of 2028 about his Civic Collaboration summer. In the Civic Collaboration summer, teams of scholars embed themselves in cities across North America to investigate community challenges and propose real solutions.

Prince, thank you so much for being here today. I’d love to just start with you telling us a bit about yourself, where you’re from, what you study.

(Prince)

All right. Yeah. Thank you for having me. My name is Prince Rivers. I’m from Durham, North Carolina. And I’m a philosophy major.

(Aadya)

Nice. Can you tell me a bit about what you’re involved with on campus? You’re a sophomore, so been here a minute.

(Prince)

I think that my favorite thing on campus, and something that I didn’t anticipate when I was coming into college, was joining the radio station. I’m a radio DJ. I have a show every week, Saturday, 10:00 a.m. to 12:00. You can tune in. My DJ name is DJ Biscuit. I’m also on the UNC Intercollegiate Ethics Bowl team. So, it’s like a debate-like competition, but more ethics-focused, and we compete against other schools. I’m also involved with the Carolina Diplomacy Fellows program.

(Aadya)

Yeah. Yeah. Shout out DJ Biscuit. Can you describe your Civic Collaboration summer a bit? Which organization did you work with?

(Prince)

So, we worked with the Alive Foundation and specifically, their MKE Fellows program. So just to give a little bit of context, Milwaukee has, like many American cities, a pretty racialized history. And Milwaukee suffers from a lot of segregation. When I was before my summer and when we were talking to the leaders of the organization leading up to the summer, they told us multiple times Milwaukee is one of the most segregated cities in America, if not the most segregated city in America. And unfortunately, that leads to a lot of disparities in educational outcomes. And so what the Alive Foundation tries—what they’re going to do through their Milwaukee Fellows program is identify young men of color who are talented, high-potential students, and they guide them throughout the college application process and the career search to help them, support them as they pursue career opportunities with the goal that they will then come back to Milwaukee and further support the community.

(Aadya)

Yeah, that’s awesome. A huge part of Civic Collaboration is for scholars to become comfortable with the ambiguity community in a project and learn how to tackle what we call a dilemma through a human-centered design process. So, I’d love for you to talk about what your team’s initial assigned dilemma was and maybe how that progressed when you arrived at Milwaukee.

(Prince)

Yeah. So, our dilemma, like you said, it was pretty ambiguous. It wasn’t super clear, but it was focused around the recent changes to college admissions policies and DEI policies. And so, we were—what they said is, these are new changes, and we’ve seen some impacts, but we don’t know fully how they’re going to impact us. And so, it was a lot about looking at how things are changing within the career landscape, within the educational landscape, and seeing what we can do to mitigate the negative impacts that those changes are having. So, seeing what the Alive Foundation can do to help their students navigate that uncertainty.

(Aadya)

Yeah. What was your initial reaction to your dilemma?

(Prince)

I was really excited about the dilemma. I mean, as a young—as a person of color myself, I thought it was super cool to be able to work with an organization that was helping people who looked like me. And it was also super pertinent. These are really significant political issues that are affecting people right now, and it’s going to be tricky to navigate that. And so, I enjoyed the opportunity to learn more about the issue and also contribute to addressing the issue.

(Aadya)

Yeah. And I’m also curious, what was your reaction to being assigned the city of Milwaukee? Did you know anything about it before?

(Prince)

Yeah, Milwaukee. I remember I opened the email and I saw Milwaukee. And it was—honestly, it was a very neutral reaction. I was like, “Okay, Milwaukee.”

(Aadya)

Milwaukee. Yeah.

(Prince)

But I definitely didn’t know anything about Milwaukee. I’d never been to the Midwest before. I don’t think I really knew anybody from Milwaukee. I don’t think my parents have been to Milwaukee, so I was like, okay.

(Aadya)

Sensing a theme here.

(Prince)

But over the next few weeks, I would tell people, “I’m going to be in Milwaukee for the summer.” And there were a few people who maybe had lived in Milwaukee or just had experience. And they’re like, “Oh, Milwaukee is a good city.” And they were always like, “Oh, but it’s really cold.” And so, I was definitely glad to be going in the summertime. And it’s also on a lake. It’s on Lake Michigan.

(Aadya)

Oh, really?

(Prince)

Yeah. Not geographically inclined. Yeah. So, there’s a beach area and stuff. And so, I saw this stuff. But in the email, they have a link to the city’s tourism page.

(Aadya)

Yes, I remember that.

(Prince)

I click on the link, and I click on the thing that says, “What to do in Milwaukee.” And it says, “Beer and cheese curds.” I say, “Okay, one of those I’m not old enough to do. And the second is cheese curds.” So, I mean, I’ll try them. I’ll try them, but I don’t know how that’s going to fill my summer. But I was happy to get Milwaukee, and I was happy with the group that I was assigned with.

(Aadya)

Yeah, I remember that feeling of neutrality because I was in Albuquerque this summer, assigned as well, and I was like, “Okay, Albuquerque? Okay, cool.” But yeah, I think everyone ends up growing to love where they end up. I’m curious how your team tackled the first few weeks. Again, for some context, we labeled these first few weeks as an exploratory mode because it’s super ambiguous. So, I’d love to hear about how your team tackled that.

(Prince)

Yeah. So, I remember when we first—the night we got there, it was probably 11:00 p.m. On the drive up, we had stopped in Chicago.

(Aadya)

Did you all drive up together?

(Prince)

We all drove up. We drove up simultaneously. But we end up getting there at night. So, we get into our neighborhood, and we can’t really see anything. So, I don’t know what to expect. And then we wake up the next morning and we go outside. And it’s 55 degrees and rainy.

(Aadya)

So, they weren’t lying.

(Prince)

And I was like, “I thought it was supposed to be summertime.” I’m coming from Chapel Hill where it was like 80 degrees and warm. And so, I’m like, “Okay, this is going to be interesting.” But a couple of days later, our first day of work, we were driving in and it was completely sunny. It was, I don’t know, 60, 70 degrees. And we drive past the lake every day on our way to work. And I look out and the lake looks beautiful.

(Aadya)

Oh, that’s awesome.

(Prince)

There’s not a cloud in the sky. It’s just really beautiful. I was like, “Okay, Milwaukee, I didn’t expect this, but this is great.” And so, we go in, we meet in person for the first time, the people who work at the organization that we’re going to be working with. And we revisit the dilemmas that we’ve been assigned. And they were very hands-off. They were like, “We appreciate you guys being here, and we know that you guys are capable.” And so, it was very much us talking to them, trying to figure out the best way that we could serve them.

And then also, additionally, it was a lot of studying the history of Milwaukee. So, there were several hours the first few days where we would all do deep dives into different aspects of Milwaukee’s history.

(Aadya)

What was your aspect?

(Prince)

And then share. I did—I think mine was just general history, the timeline of the city. And other people did maybe educational history. And so, I learned about how Milwaukee is a rust belt city. And so, during the late 1900s, experienced a lot of deindustrialization, which really, really hurt the city. And they experienced a really large population decline, which definitely explains some of the challenges that the city is facing now. And that was really interesting to me because I had no—I never envisioned that there were like, American cities, like several American cities where the population had declined since the ‘60s. I was like—

(Aadya)

I didn’t even know Pittsburgh, but I didn’t know that was Milwaukee, too.

(Prince)

Yeah, Milwaukee, definitely. And so, studying Milwaukee’s history and then interviewing the organizational leaders to understand just different aspects of the organization. It was just a lot of—it was a lot of asking questions to different people. So even when we weren’t at work, we would talk to just random people in restaurants and stuff about their thoughts on Milwaukee, different things that they knew about Milwaukee’s history. But there was definitely a focus on Milwaukee’s educational history and to understand what the Milwaukee educational landscape looks like to inform the way—inform our thinking because it was a very education-focused project.

(Aadya)

Yeah. I just remember when I got there, I felt this anxiety that I couldn’t do anything because I’m just this random person in a random city. Can you talk about if you felt that, how you mitigated that?

(Prince)

Yeah, I definitely experienced that. I remember, and I’m sure every city is like that, but feeling like Milwaukee has such a complicated history.

(Aadya)

Yeah, what am I going to do?

(Prince)

I’m not sure. Yeah, what am I going to do? I think that the thing that most helped me was our—the folks at our organization, they had a lot of trust in us.

(Aadya)

Yeah.

(Prince)

And they shared different parts of Milwaukee that they enjoyed with us. So, recommending summer events and restaurants, things to do, things like that. And so being embraced into the Milwaukee community by them helped me feel like, “Okay, I don’t know everything about Milwaukee. And also, if I put in the time to learn and invest in the city, then I don’t necessarily have to feel out of place doing what I can to lend a helping hand.”

(Aadya)

Yeah, I really like the way you explained that. That’s how I felt by the end. Can you just talk to me a bit about how the project progressed? At what point did you feel like you had an understanding and started to move into a solutionizing mindset?

(Prince)

Yeah, it was a lot of talking to folks, superintendents, nonprofit leaders, even business leaders, to try to understand their perspective on the source of the disparities. And it seemed like a lot of what it was is just like—it makes sense. It’s just like there’s differently resourced schools. And so, what we did is we looked at the programming that our organization provides to the fellows that they’re supporting. And we said, “Okay, what can we do so that the fellows that they’re supporting are on equal footing with students in Milwaukee who can afford private education or a private college application tutor?”

(Aadya)

Yeah. So, what did your deliverable end up being?

(Prince)

Yeah. So, ours was a strategic plan that was informed by not only the interviews we had with leaders in the community, but also students we interviewed who were either—had gone through the college application process or were about to go through the college application process. So, students, if they had already gone through the college application process, we had them reflect on challenges and ways in which they could have been supported. And then for students who are about to go, thinking about their anxieties. So, one thing we did, the MCN is run by a company called—

(Aadya)

That’s the Morehead-Cain Network.

(Prince)

—is run by a company called Hivebrite, and we got in contact with Hivebrite, and we got a deal with them to set up a similar platform for that organization at a slightly reduced fee. So, I think that’s super cool. And then we also developed a programming series for students starting when they become fellows in their junior year of high school, mainly leading up to the—

(Aadya)

Mapping it out?

(Prince)

—leading up to when they enter college so that they know exactly—they have a vision of the college application process timeline, what they need to do and when, and then also supporting them before they go to college so that they can have an understanding of what to do when they enter college. Because college can be like—even when you get to college, it can be really daunting knowing how to navigate it.

(Aadya)

Yeah, 100%. Outside of work, I want to hear some stories from you and your house. Can you share one of your favorite outside-of-work stories from your housemates and you?

(Prince)

Okay, I think the most fun thing that we did outside of work was Summerfest. And it was really funny because whenever I would ask people before going to Milwaukee, what was there to do? They’d be like, “Oh, have you heard of Summerfest?” And then when we got to Milwaukee, we told people, “Oh, yeah, we’re in Milwaukee for the summer.” “Are you going to Summerfest?” Our first day of work, our boss was meeting with somebody from the Boys and Girls Club in Milwaukee, and he introduced us, and the guy whipped out Summerfest tickets and was like, “Here’s Summerfest tickets.”

(Aadya)

Wait, that’s—we’re going to Summerfest. Can you tell us what Summerfest is?

(Prince)

Summerfest is, they say it’s the biggest music festival in the United States or the world. It’s over the course of three weeks. It’s four days each weekend. It’s Thursday through Sunday. I think it starts in July or maybe late June. But it’s just a really big music festival with all sorts of artists. It’s—and it’s really fun. It’s very intergenerational. Everybody goes with their families, and there’s all sorts of fun food stalls. And they had a skateboarding show there. There was a lot going on. It was fun, though.

(Aadya)

That’s awesome. Okay. And I think my last question for you is, what’s the greatest lesson you learned from your Civic Collaboration summer?

(Prince)

That’s a tough question. The greatest—

(Aadya)

It can be a synthesis of a couple of smaller lessons, too.

(Prince)

I know in our reflection, we have those five takeaways. If you want to bring up some of those, too.

(Aadya)

I think that when I think about—I think when I think about the most powerful moments from the summer, for me, it was the interviews. When we were interviewing folks, whether that was students or adults who were nonprofit leaders in the community, it was always really evident that people cared that we cared.

(Prince)

Yeah.

(Aadya)

And so, I think that it was super cool for me to see that my investment in an issue that is impacting people, people care about.

(Prince)

Yes.

(Aadya)

And so, I think that going forward, I guess, when I’m thinking about whether it’s just interpersonal relationships or work in general, doing the work to invest the time in other people is not a wasted thing. And people do really care about that.

(Prince)

Yeah, I think it helps you define your place in the world a bit more, too.

(Aadya)

Are you going to go back to Milwaukee ever?

(Prince)

I’ll definitely be back.

(Aadya)

Next Summerfest? Okay, well, thank you so much for being here, Prince. And thank you for listening to Kickin’ It in the Kitchen, a series by the Catalyze podcast. I’m your host, Aadya Gattu from the class of 2028, and that was Prince Rivers from the class of 2028. You can learn more about the Morehead-Cain Summer Enrichment Program on our website at moreheadcain.org. This episode was recorded on video at the Morehead-Cain Foundation at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill. You can watch all of the Kickin’ It in the Kitchen videos on our YouTube channel @moreheadcain. And if you prefer to listen, find Catalyze wherever you get your podcasts. You can let us know what you thought of this episode by emailing us at communications@moreheadcain.org or by finding us on social media @moreheadcain. Thanks for listening.